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Ethan W
03-30-2007, 10:17 AM
OK guys this really belongs in here. I know alot of you use eBay and PayPal for payment.

BE AWARE... PAYPAL protection does not exist regardless of their ****e advertising.

So that being said here is what you need to do to have your own protection. Use you one credit card protection (Visa, Master, AM, etc,etc) Not the plasticcheck card.

Here is the trick. When you pay with PayPal the funds will be deducted by default from you registered bank account.
Everytime you pay switch the funds deduction to your Credit Card registered with your PayPal account. By defatult is set to your bank account and the f*ockers won't let you change that.

Of course they won't since they kow how much they suck at recovering peoples money.

So just go the extra step and SWITCH to pay with funds from your PayPal registered credit card and that will enable you do DECLINE charges through your own bank....

So that being said, YES PAYPAL SUCKS

See some stories for yourself.....

PayPal SUCKS (www.paypalsucks.com)

XTREMETUNING
03-30-2007, 10:35 AM
I hear you... I got screwed for about $500 by paypal over a transaction with a Roadfly member less then a month ago. Paypal is not help at all!

-JRW

mwrench
03-30-2007, 10:40 AM
Did you get screwed by Paypal or the guy you bought from. I am not putting you down in your belief but hasn't it always been buyer beware? Sales over the Internet is/has been a haven for people to take advantage of others as we see all the time. BUT, is that Paypal's fault?

I have more trouble with CC companies and their HIGH interest rate but I can make a decision not to use them as well as I can exercise caution in buying.

I guess I'm from the old school, I don't buy unless I can feel or touch, or someone I know can verify the integrity of the goods.

My 0.02cEd
www.mwrench.com
http://forums1.roadfly.com/preferences/showsigimage.php?img=118006

Wuffer
03-30-2007, 10:43 AM
And who was the Roadfly member so the rest of us can be wary of him/her and avoid the same issue?
<img src="http://members.roadfly.com/wuffer/R1n2sig.jpg">
www.wuffer.net
Langley, BC Canada
91 E31 WufferRed CB72884 (R #1)
91 E31 WufferRed CB73065 (R #2)
92 Lexus SC400 Green (familymobile)
01 PT Cruiser (wifemobile)

Ethan W
03-30-2007, 10:45 AM
their user agreement and policy. When it comes to honoring their side they never do and that's way they SUCK.

We live in the internet age and as such we have to adapt, taking the good and the bad. When you only have Paypal used for payment and there is no true competition you're pretty much at their mercy. Being roialy SCREWED...... Is like every other monopoly

Just read the horor stories on the www.paypalsucks.com

charlie
03-30-2007, 11:40 AM
*** Guys I just resurrected this thread from the "m-o-m" dungeon and protected it so it couldn't go back. ***

PayPal does suck! They nearly have a monopoly on the market due to their eBay ownership and eBay's banning of Google Checkout from eBay.

There are many horror stories out there regarding PayPal. We get many emails asking for our help when people get taken. Obviously we can offer nearly no help which saddens us. PayPal is as much to blame as eBay and the sellers.

I can give you one personal story for those using AMEX. AMEX will not stop payment to PayPal. Period! It's their policy. I don't have any personal experience w/ Visa or M/C regarding PayPal. In my case, I ordered a dash cluster for a car, the cluster came and had burn issues. It came out of a fire car. Obviously the guts of the cluster were DOA. The seller barely would return my emails. I finally went to PayPal, etc. When I didn't get satisfaction I went to AMEX. AMEX told me it was company policy to not dispute payments to escrow services. They told me to take it small claims court. Finally, I couldn't spend any more time on it and gave up. The libtard in me decided that if the movie producer guy from LA who sold me the part needed to steal from me that bad then he was hopefully using the money to buy food. At least that's what I told myself so I didn't get on a plane and hunt the scammer down.

Ethan W
03-30-2007, 11:42 AM

charlie
03-30-2007, 11:44 AM
Ethan, before you start jumping to conclusions and getting yourself all worked up about the community removing your posts you should learn how Mod-O-Matic works. It's an incredible feature and works like a charm. There's a link explaining how it works above each post.

See this phrase above: "Please flag with care."

Ethan W
03-30-2007, 11:46 AM
learn how the system works. Yea automation, gotta love it ....

An honest sorry again.....

Ethan

charlie
03-30-2007, 11:46 AM
I'm leaving this post in the E31 forum for the time being. Later today or tomorrow I'm going to move it to the Alerts/Fraud forum where it can be read by folks learning about Internet fraud, etc.

charlie
03-30-2007, 11:47 AM

Ethan W
03-30-2007, 11:47 AM

XTREMETUNING
03-30-2007, 12:39 PM
I will leave the person's name out of this because I have hopes that he will make this right....

So it goes like this ->

I contacted a memeber that was looking a specific part for his car. I had an extra set and was willing to get rid of them. We exchanged about 15 emails and I answered all of his questions. He sent me $500 via paypal and asked that I ship them out the very next day. This was a pain for me, but did as he wished and the parts went out the very next day via UPS ground.

About two days later I go to send someone money from my account and find that the person has filed a dispute and the money was now no longer in my account (it was being held by paypal). I emailed him and he gave me a story about paypal taking the money from an incorrect account and he was going to resend the money, but it was taken from a bank account instead of a credit card... dont ask me! So, he said don't worry. Paypal asked me for a tracking number which I provided so I thought I was fine.

Next, thing I know he emails me stating that I ripped him off and that the parts weren't what he wanted. He said that they didn't fit the car correctly... this that and the other thing. Paypal then tells me that the case is closed because the bank reversed the transaction and there was nothing that I nor Paypal could do about it. CASE CLOSED!

So, I tell the guy to just ship the parts back since he already got a full refund. He refused and he has not responded to my last emails.

Honestly, even if I sent crappy parts ... he filed the dispute two days before the parts even got to his door. If I was smarter, I would have called UPS and cancelled the delevery.

I have bought and sold parts on Roadfly, ebay, and a bunch of other car and car audio forums with no problems over the last 8+ years. I have +112 feedback on ebay having bought and sold single items for 10's of thousands of dollars at a time. Any problem I have ever had has been easily resolved, but this guy is really sneaky and impossible to work with.

So, thats my story... I still hope to get the parts back but its not looking good.

-JRW

mwrench
03-30-2007, 12:44 PM
Really tough laws that can go after the originators of scams! Is it possible that laws don't give Paypal enough latitude? Don't get me wrong, I am not a fan of or have any affiliation with Paypal, I do use their services from time to time.

If it is so hard to go after the real criminals, and laws do not have teeth why would other companies join in to compete with Paypal, not worth it and Paypal will remain the "monopoly". The more we go after Paypal the more others will take note and stay away. The cost of business would be prohibitive and risk factors be to high.

A good start would be a National small claims court!Ed
www.mwrench.com
http://forums1.roadfly.com/preferences/showsigimage.php?img=118006

Ethan W
03-30-2007, 12:51 PM
I mean in the credit card world you dispute a charge and you get your money back. It takes 2 minutes to fill the paperwork and the rest is done by the bank. It works every time...

If I ENTRUST my money to PayPal they should protect it. I mean that's what their policy say right?

I mean are they getting rich at the customer expense? And who protects our rights? We just take dry like everything else, right?

At some point there will be enough complaints to justify taking them to court and I can't wait for that day....

zm850i
03-30-2007, 12:51 PM
sense of security to its users.

zm850i
03-30-2007, 01:01 PM
hate to say this buy if you wait it may be too late
For you and others here.

chromeowner
03-30-2007, 01:02 PM

mwrench
03-30-2007, 01:02 PM
by someone he sold to that was using the very same method that others here have recommended using to protect themselves when buying.

Yikes!Ed
www.mwrench.com
http://forums1.roadfly.com/preferences/showsigimage.php?img=118006

mwrench
03-30-2007, 01:03 PM
Ed
www.mwrench.com
http://forums1.roadfly.com/preferences/showsigimage.php?img=118006

Ethan W
03-30-2007, 01:26 PM
from his bank account and not the credit card..

"but it was taken from a bank account instead of a credit card... dont ask me!"

That's why I am trying to make everybody aware when paying via PayPal..

USE the funds from the Credit Card registered with PayPal and not with the Bank account registered with PayPal.

When PayPal screws you like they allways do, all you have to do is decline the charges paid to PayPal and you're done...

If you pay with the bank funds, then is nothing you can do about it and PayPal got you by the cojones....

Ethan W
03-30-2007, 01:29 PM
search for posts between XTREMETUNING and anyone regarding andy "buy and sale" activities. From there narrow down to the amount of $$$ paid and at that point we may be very close...

Maybe force the SCAMER to surface and take care of the business???

jef
03-30-2007, 01:34 PM
http://forums1.roadfly.com/preferences/showsigimage.php?img=71085

XTREMETUNING
03-30-2007, 02:21 PM
The guy paid my via Paypal and it seems that his Paypal account was funded by his bank account. He paid me for the parts... and then I shipped them.

He then went to his bank and had the bank reverse the funds... I guess taking them from Paypal. I guess this is the same thing as doing a reversal on your credit card.

Paypal did not find me at fault in the claim since I was able to provide a valid UPS tracking number. They simply could not do anything since the funds were taken back by the bank. Of course they would rather screw the little guy then fight the big bad bank!

-JRW

Ethan W
03-30-2007, 02:33 PM
removes a post after some human form did flag that post, or it does it automaticaly based on some builtin filter... Just curious....

Thanks
Ethan

Ethan W
03-30-2007, 02:35 PM

Wuffer
03-30-2007, 03:01 PM
Hmmm....I sell and ship plenty of parts regularly to many people here on Roadfly but unlike you have never been burned. I would really like to keep it this way so would be most greatful if you would email me the name of the offender if you do not feel comfortable posting it here. Personally I feel that this person should be exposed so none of us may be burned by him. Your cooperation is solicited.
<img src="http://members.roadfly.com/wuffer/R1n2sig.jpg">
www.wuffer.net
Langley, BC Canada
91 E31 WufferRed CB72884 (R #1)
91 E31 WufferRed CB73065 (R #2)
92 Lexus SC400 Green (familymobile)
01 PT Cruiser (wifemobile)

Dave Simpson
03-30-2007, 03:04 PM
The key not to get beat out of your money is to NOT get verified and I stress NOT! By getting verified, it allows them access to bank accounts. Just use credit cards and you shouldn't have any problems.

Dave Simpson '91 850i

Ethan W
03-30-2007, 03:06 PM
belong in this forum.... Simple as that....

Ethan W
03-30-2007, 03:07 PM
That is better than anything I known so far. Really good TIP.

Thank you Sir.....

justaguyinokc
03-30-2007, 05:05 PM
Sounds like a felony to me.

What that person did is considered Theft by Deception, and since it (I'm assuming here) crossed state lines it is automatically a felony, it could possibly involve the FBI.

I would also contact the Attorney General for the state in which the person resides, as well as the FBI, to report the crime ASAP, and to get it on record.

Then, of course, there is civil litigation (a PITA considering the amount involved).

http://members.roadfly.org/justaguyinokc/850Gif.gif
http://members.roadfly.org/justaguyinokc/sigout.jpg

charlie
03-30-2007, 08:22 PM
clicking by members causes the removal. There are no automated filters reading the content. The weight of a click varies based on tenure and IC status.

Ethan W
03-30-2007, 09:02 PM
who did this.. Is anyone here having any beef with my posts? Please step up and be a MAN....

Lulach
03-30-2007, 09:06 PM

Ethan W
03-30-2007, 09:56 PM
the program or not?

Please mind your business Sir if you don't have anything constructive to say....

TX Greg
03-30-2007, 10:37 PM

TX Greg
03-30-2007, 10:41 PM
post the name for all.


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