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Bill Minder
03-03-2000, 06:31 PM
An owner of a 745 told me to avoid the e23 at all costs. He said he had one where the HVAC went out and he could not get to the unit without destroying the dash. He said he's been told that if the HVAC unit fails, the car is basically totalled. <br>He also said that the suspension parts are weak, and the electronics are a nightmare. <br>Has anyone had these experiences? I ask because I might be able to pick up a '79 for next to nothing, literally.

John Galt
03-03-2000, 07:14 PM
I think he is referring to the heater core. In the E23, like in most cars, the heater core is buried deep in the dash. It can start to leak, in which case it MUST be fixed (the car will be undriveable). Like most cars, its a pain to get to the heater core, and racks up a lot of labor (as much as 10-15 hours of labor time at most shops).<p>If you've got an old car that is only worth a few thousand, replacing the heater core can start to cost a significant percentage of the value of the car. But that's not anything that is unique to the E23.<p>However, you don't need to "destroy" the dash to get to it!<p>Some of the suspension bushings are a little weak, but they can be upgraded with stronger parts. Not that big of a deal, and again, not anything really unique to the E23. Most old cars could use new suspension bushings!<p>Same with electronics, I don't think the E23 is any worse than any other old, high-line car.<p>: An owner of a 745 told me to avoid the e23 at all costs. He said he had one where the HVAC went out and he could not get to the unit without destroying the dash. He said he's been told that if the HVAC unit fails, the car is basically totalled. <br>: He also said that the suspension parts are weak, and the electronics are a nightmare. <br>: Has anyone had these experiences? I ask because I might be able to pick up a '79 for next to nothing, literally.<p>

Bill Minder
03-03-2000, 07:22 PM
I've got a '77 530i so I'm not new to BMW's. I just would like a larger Bimmer, but I don't want to buy a nightmare from Bavaria. I would like to get the '79 because the mechanicals are basically identical to my e12. But if the heater core or the ac is almost impossible to get to, it might scare me off.

Grant
03-03-2000, 09:09 PM
<i>: I've got a '77 530i so I'm not new to BMW's. I just would like a larger Bimmer, but I don't want to buy a nightmare from Bavaria. I would like to get the '79 because the mechanicals are basically identical to my e12. But if the heater core or the ac is almost impossible to get to, it might scare me off.<p></i><p>My 85 735i has had its share of heater problems. But no worse that my former 95 Ford Taurus which cost $550 to replace the heater core which required removal of the dash to complete the job. Anyway the weak link in my heater is the final stage controllers for the blower. High current draw will cause those little components to "burn up".

Bob
03-03-2000, 11:48 PM
I know of stories where the dealer has charged $3500 to "fix" a heater on an e23.<p>I recently bought an e32 735i that the PO got fed up with after the dealer charged him $4000 to "fix" twice (it still doesn't work right), then the heater core began to leak. They wanted another $1800 to replace it!! He cried "uncle" and sold it.<p>Moral: DIY or think of a different car to own. They are great cars, but dealers see you as a mark if you patronize them with older BMWs.<p>Bob<p>Bob

sam
03-04-2000, 09:18 AM
<br>Dunno bout e23 but the e32 there's a how to on replacing the heater core. 14 hours of your time, thats not really that bad. 14 hours x 60 dollars is $840 labour charge to my mechanic. I dunno how much the core replacement is but can't be that much more for an aftermarket.<br><i>: I know of stories where the dealer has charged $3500 to "fix" a heater on an e23.<p>: I recently bought an e32 735i that the PO got fed up with after the dealer charged him $4000 to "fix" twice (it still doesn't work right), then the heater core began to leak. They wanted another $1800 to replace it!! He cried "uncle" and sold it.<p>: Moral: DIY or think of a different car to own. They are great cars, but dealers see you as a mark if you patronize them with older BMWs.<p>: Bob<p>: Bob<p></i>

RichNoland
03-05-2000, 02:33 PM
<br>: Has anyone had these experiences? <p>HEATER CORE REPLACEMENT/í83 733iM5<br>The repair instructions I have are wrong. Everyone needs an exploding view of the heater assembly, which I donít have. I am reading section 17-65 of some BMW manual and there are no pictures and I cannot make out their directions and terminology. So I have cleaned up the directions the best I could.<p>Disconnect the negative post on the battery.<p>1&2. Drain coolant and refrigerant. -- Neither one is correct. You donít touch the a/c and you need only to pinch off the flow of coolant to the heater entrance and exit. You can use the car if you bypass the heater entrance and exit with a hose across the engine.<br>3. Remove instrument trim panel. -- I took off the bottom trim where the ashtray is, under the steering column and the part of the console that hooks onto the gear shifter, not the glove compartment. <br>4. Outside, remove the cowl.<br>5. Outside, remove the heater assembly cover attaching screws(10) and remove the cover. <br>6. Outlide, disconnect heater hoses. -- Lay air-flow fins aside. One heater hose on either side of the fan. <br>7. Inside, disconnect the vacuum lines. -- Not true. After removing the clear plastic cover, disconnet only the black one remembering exactly where attached (make diagram) and stuff vacuum/relay assembly into radio (after pulled out and laid on the dash) compartment from the rear. <br>8. Bend open the heater duct mounting clamp. -- This will take some guts because you actually must cut the metal brace with shears at the top and bottom enough to pull out the cover of the heater core out after taking the two bolts loose at the bottom and the four attaching clips.<br>9. Disconnect the central electrical lead. -- Not true. Itís on the vacuum/relay assembly that you stuffed behind the radio compartment.<br>10. Pull the duct cover downward and remove it. -- I call this the heater-core cover you removed above.<br>11. Remove the center strut attaching bolts. -- Not needed since you cut the metal. What they are suggesting would add an hour or more to the labor.<br>12. Remove the insulation from the refrigerant lines. -- Unless this was changed since or before my í83, this is garbage. Ignore.<br>13. Disconnect the refrigerant lines from the evaporator. -- Garbage. Ignore.<br>14. Disconnect the evaporator drain tube. -- Garbage. Ignore.<br>15. Remove the heater-assembly-retaining bolt, remove the heater and heater core. --This is totally wrong. Pull out heater core about 2-3 inches past the brace. On each side of the core is a tube running up to the hoses that you removed. They mount to the core with two bolts that must be loosened, almost out, in order for them to pivot when you remove the core. Pull out the core and replace or repair. Put in new o-rings where they join.<br>16. Install by reverse.<p>I cannot believe this is so hard and I did not have to take the refrigerant or coolant out. It took me six hours, turnaround. Paul Harvey speaks so highly of JDWeld that I thought I might find the hole and put JDWeld on the hole. It's supposed to be good to 600 degrees. It worked for me. Make sure you have the core boiled out professionally.<p>This all started because I overheated the radiator that has since been fixed and boiled out (about $50). Do that at first signs of overheating so that your heater core does not blow. I had bypassed the heater core, which blew out, for about 6 months while getting the guts to tackle the job. <p>Rich<p><br>

Marguerite
03-05-2000, 10:21 PM
Bill,<br> If you do the work yourself you can avoid all that labor. It sounds like you just got a big scare. Let's face it a car that old will require transplants. That's absurd that you'd ruin dash. Take a look under there, it all comes apart in sections. Again on suspension, look at it this way, it's your opportunity to replace suspension components with those which appeal to you. Most important in my opinion is that you haven't picked a rust bucket. <p>good luck and hope it works out for you. I can't part with my 7, no matter how rusty it is!<br>Marguerite<br>'82 733i 5 spd<br>'85 528e "<p><br>: An owner of a 745 told me to avoid the e23 at all costs. He said he had one where the HVAC went out and he could not get to the unit without destroying the dash. He said he's been told that if the HVAC unit fails, the car is basically totalled. <br>: He also said that the suspension parts are weak, and the electronics are a nightmare. <br>: Has anyone had these experiences? I ask because I might be able to pick up a '79 for next to nothing, literally.<p>

Korby (Corebie)
03-10-2000, 11:43 AM
Here's my two cents worth: I bought an 85 735i with the core bypassed for $4,400. I was quoted about $1,000 by a local independent for core replacement. I decided to do it myself.<p>The good news is there are a lot of owners in the same boat and people at this site can help you. The core and ALL heater hoses were shipped to my door for about $150 US. I now know my first bimmer VERY well. <p>The bad news is, it really is a time consuming project, and not one you want to hurry because the parts are fragile (compared to engine work). There are a LOT of little steps. Best bet is to allow lots of time, stay organized, do research and be patient. <p>It can be done. I took pics as I went along (over 30 of them) with the idea of making an additional web resource for others. I haven't found the time to make the web site, but if you feel like downloading about 8 MB worth of pics, I can show you what you'd be getting yourself into. This offer is extended to anyone in this situation.<p>I agree with all the comments of the other replies to your posts too...once again...you've got help here. I couldn't have done it without this board.<p>Have fun!!!!<p>Korby<p><i>: An owner of a 745 told me to avoid the e23 at all costs. He said he had one where the HVAC went out and he could not get to the unit without destroying the dash. He said he's been told that if the HVAC unit fails, the car is basically totalled. <br>: He also said that the suspension parts are weak, and the electronics are a nightmare. <br>: Has anyone had these experiences? I ask because I might be able to pick up a '79 for next to nothing, literally.<p></i>

Barry
03-14-2000, 04:39 PM
<i>: An owner of a 745 told me to avoid the e23 at all costs. He said he had one where the HVAC went out and he could not get to the unit without destroying the dash. He said he's been told that if the HVAC unit fails, the car is basically totalled. <br>: He also said that the suspension parts are weak, and the electronics are a nightmare. <br>: Has anyone had these experiences? I ask because I might be able to pick up a '79 for next to nothing, literally.<p><br>The good news is my E23 is great. Guess what the heater core in my 87 735 just went out.<p>My approach to this one is let someone who knows how do this one. The job takes 6 hours by someone who knows how. In fact mine will be done tomorrow. Cost for me about $600.00<p>No Not by the dealer, by an authorized BMW Mech. <p>Years ago I found out there are shops who specialize in working on MBZ and BMW who have been trained by BMW and MBZ. I have both cars and I take both cars to these specialists. Their cost are no where near the dealer and the quality of their work is outstanding. <p>There are some things I go to the dealer for ie smog checks and special deals they offer but with 141,000 miles and still looking like new its worth the heater core to me.<p>Barry <br></i>


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