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flim
09-07-2002, 12:05 PM
will there be any noticable difference of anything if i add a K&N air filter?<br><img src="http://paribusrecords.50megs.com/picts/sig.jpg">

4thm3
09-07-2002, 12:10 PM
Jim Conforti and my previous engine builder say the same
thing. Esp on the e46m3 where there are concerns about narrow
oil passages getting clogged, i would not use a K&N. Even
tho the foam filters (like ITG) are much better, on this engine,
i would be extremely cautious; ie what if your engine blows
and BMW says its becuz you used a non-authorized filter?

dave01m3
09-07-2002, 12:16 PM
available for the E46 M3 with any aftermarket air filter. My own experience is with my 98 Cobra. Removing the OEM paper cone filter with a K&N was worth 4 rwhp on my 98 Cobra, pulling the silencer off got me another 3 rwhp for a total of 7 rwhp. The Cobra IMHO is a somewhat better filter than the M3 as it is cone shaped with more surface area while the E46 M3 as well as all E46 3 series uses a panel filter. Do I have flow #'s and pressure drop #'s no. Someone posted a very good article on the K&N vs. ITG vs. OEM paper. The K&N came out ahead quite a bit on flow capability over the OEM paper especially after it had some mileage on the filter. The OEM had a good dropoff after just a few thousand miles. If you do a search maybe you can find te article. As far as the rumor that they don't protect as well as the OEM filter I think is a bunch of BS. It is the same technology the US Army uses for its turbine powered M1A2 Abrahams tank as far as filtration for the powerplant is concerned. Dave.

02M3CB
09-07-2002, 12:33 PM
you may not even see any gains between a clean/new stock filter and the K&N. I know after putting it on my Mustang and then one on a Z/28, I quit using them. My throttle bodies would get all mucked up quicker. on my SS, I stuck with changing the fram filter every oil change (3K) since I did't care about $10.

dave01m3
09-07-2002, 12:42 PM
filters?? They are the worse oil filter you can buy. Dude, there have been several intense and exhaustive studies done on oil filters and the Fram was junk. Either use a Purolator, AC Delco, or a Motorcraft. As far as the BMW goes, go with OEM. BTW, Purolator makes AC Delco as well as Motorcraft oil filters. Dave.

glowrider
09-07-2002, 12:50 PM
Filter had nothign to do with it and BMW acknowledged that...

Gregm3SJ
09-07-2002, 12:55 PM
I have heard this on the forum before. It's a crock. 90% of race cars use this filter. Bmw and Dinan both say they cause no problems.

Stop treating it like a baby.

4thm3
09-07-2002, 01:04 PM
Ahem, i've bought lots of products from Dinan (Stroker on
325is and Stg 2 supercharger on 96 M3). But on this, i will
defer to Jim Conforti & my previous mechanic/engine builder.

Do you think Jim Conforti is full of crock ? :-)

4thm3
09-07-2002, 01:08 PM
Engines can fail for lots of reasons, i just wouldn't want
to subject my S54 engine to any more dirt that might
clog an oil passage; esp near the crank bearing shells.

Again, if Jim Conforti confirms what my previous mechanic
who rebuilt engines for a living, then thats good enough
for me. Jim did a lot of tests of particulates, my
mechanic saw the excessive wear.

dave01m3
09-07-2002, 06:09 PM
aftermarket filter. As long as it meets a certain manafacturing requirements of the automaker, which K&N does. If that was the case they would have to provide you with a free airfilter, this is in the SEMA act that was passed quite a few years ago. As far as K&N allowing more dirt this isn't true as well. Please show the scientific proof of this. ITG has worse filtration when dirty than a K&N and the K&N will still outflow the ITG filter. I'm sorry I have seen several reports on this, including one that was posted here but I couldn't find it in the search. Dave.

02M3CB
09-07-2002, 06:33 PM
I actually used Mobil 1 Oil Filters and would change the AIR FILTER at each oil change...every 3K miles. Sorry for the confusion.

4thm3
09-07-2002, 06:59 PM
There was a long discussion on the UUC Digest list, back
in the days of Duane Collie and the 323tds :-). If you had
an e36m3 (i've had 2), you would have read this thread where
the topic was beaten to a pulp. Ditto for the hinged vs
solid (non-flexing) strut bars (not to say that hinged bars
don't do any good, they're just not as effective as non-flexing
but i digress). You must realize that there have been many
venerable M3 mailing lists over the yrs, from Welty's to the
UUC digest. For those with really long memories, they will
also recall that in the late 80's Jim Conforti was a fan of
K&N filters, citing their million mile warranty on Welty's list.

Jim Conforti, likely with Josh of Eurosports, did the filtration
tests of the K&N vs other brands- thats how they came to discover
that the ITG foam filter was superior at blocking fine
particulates (dont recall the exact size). They tested many
filters but eventually signed some kind of deal where Eurosports
got an exclusive license using ITGs in BMWs - even tho
many vendors sell ITG filters for Hondas, VWs etc.

I for one, trust Jim & Josh's attention to detail. Its the same
level of rigor that enabled Jim to first crack OBDII in a manner
that BMW could not tell - before Dinan. (Dinan eventually caught
up, refining their VANOS tuning- i was a beneficiary in my 96M3
with Stg 2 Dinan supercharger). It does surprise me that Dinan
continues to use K&N's in their cold air intake systems.

I really dont care if the K&N flows more air than a dirty
ITG. K&N flows more because it has bigger holes - thats what
Jim & Josh concluded.

Re: SEMA, what you say is true but think about the rationale
for why Dinan went to all the trouble negotiating with BMW to
offer a supplemental warranty for their after-market parts.
And even there, the customer can be left holding the proverbial
bag if Dinan & BMW bounce the responsibility ball back & forth.

02M3CB
09-07-2002, 07:10 PM
throttle body of a K&N filtered car vice one that is not - you'll see more gunk on the throttle body of the K&N. I don't want the residual oil and crap in my engine...I quit using them. You simply are NOT going to notice 2-3 hp. In addition to that, the LS1.com forum did a test between a new paper filter and the K&N and the paper flowed the same if not more air when new so I just started changed my air filter each time I changed the oil. I currently have BMW change my M3 oil and filter every 3K and will have the air filter done every 6K.

4thm3
09-07-2002, 07:16 PM
Oddlycalm posted a speculation that de facto oil starvation
may be the trigger for failed engines (inadequate design causing
poor oil transfer). If this is true, i for one want the
cleanest oil possible and that means no K&N for me. Frequent
stock air filter changes as Carbon BlackM3 suggests is likely
a wise move.


<a href="http://forums.roadfly.org/bmw/forums/e46m3/forum.php?postid=634030&page=1">design problem?</a>

dave01m3
09-07-2002, 08:47 PM
Cobra as well along with Mobil 1 5-30 Tri-synthetic oil. Dave.

dave01m3
09-07-2002, 08:53 PM
guys I have used K&N for years. Put 50K miles on a 95 Cobra,when I went to install my GT40X heads from Ford Racing Performance Parts, the cylinder walls as well as the combustion chambers were extremly clean. You could see there was no scoring, no burrs no nothing like this. In fact you could still see the cylinder walls and the honing pattern. Sorry I just don't agree about the K&N air filters. One will be going into my M3 as soon as it arrives. To each his own. Dave.

StMedina
09-07-2002, 09:22 PM
<br><font color=maroon><font size=1><font>

02M3CB
09-08-2002, 07:47 PM


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