8:15 vs. 8:09

[Wldeyefoto]

BMW's current superstar, the all-new M6, has recently recorded an 8:09 lap of the Nordschleife circuit at Nurburgring. This car has carbon fiber body parts, a 507 HP V-10 with a redline of 8250 rpms, a 7 speed SMG transmission, 14.74" front rotors and 14.5" rears, a limited slip differential, and 19" lightweight forged alloy wheels with state-of-the-art R-compound 255/40 Pirelli P Zero Corsas up front and 285/35s in the rear. Pretty impressive stuff! How does it compare to our old-tech Z8s? BMW reported a Nordschleife lap time of 8:15 for the Z8 running a 394 HP V8 with a 7000 rpm redline, on heavy cast aluminum 18" wheels shod with severely compromised 245/45 and 275/40 run-flat tires, a 6-speed manual transmission, 13.1" front rotors and 12.9" rears, and an open differential! Remember, this is a 12 mile per lap road course where 6 seconds could easily be erased by a different tire choice. With a few updates to take advantage of current technology, I'd guess the old girl would raise a few eyebrows at the 'Ring! So don't be fooled by all the marketing hype, you're still driving "The Ultimate"!Grease Monkey

[rjay]

Methinks you should take your modified car over there and teach em a lesson! 6 seconds is indeed a blink of the eye on that track, so with tires, LSD, dinan S2, wheels, suspension, etc, the Z8 should take the M6 pretty handily I would hope.

[dwz8]

if GM takes his modified car to the NS and is able to drive it faster than 8:15 I'll pay for his flight ticket.

Unless you know the Ring inside out there is no chance that you get close to these times.

[Wldeyefoto]

The discussion is about the Z8, not the driver. The times posted were achieved by professional drivers employed by BMW. I would never pretend to be their equal. But I do believe an updated Z8 in their hands would blow the doors off the new M6.Grease Monkey

[dwz8]

I know, no problem, just wanted to make the point that the car is just a small part of the game there.

You may be right, although a couple of details come to my mind: sport auto did the test, they ran the M6 with the Conti tires, their comment was that the Pirelli Corsas did not help to improve the time.

As far as improvements go, there is certainly room for this. The main problem of the Z8 on the Ring is its weight (same for the M6, which is even heavier).

BMW certainly knows how to build great engines.
It would be marvellous if they would remember that weight is equally important. An M6 with 1,500 kg would make a whole lot of a difference, as well as a Z8 with 300 pounds less.

[johnsonr]

of course, drivers would have to be identical for any comparison, then the car is "the whole game". Rjay

[dwz8]

I am not good enough to reach these times to be honest. I have never taken any precise times, they should be in the 8:30 to 8:45 range.

For a pro, it should be possible to reach 8:00 or a bit below with my car as it is. Once you get to this range, it is no longer the power that counts, it is much more the setup and the weight.

[Wldeyefoto]

I totally agree with your statement concerning weight. I have been able to remove 160 lbs. from my Z8 and the difference is very noticeable. Unfortunately I'm running out of ways to lighten the car except perhaps by changing the seats to lightweight racing versions and there are some substantial problems associated with such a move. Fitment of the modern wide-shoulder designs is impractical in the Z8 due to the extremely narrow cockpit dimensions in that area plus seat belt attachment/communication is problematic with aftermarket seats. I continue to search for an option and would be delighted to hear from anyone who has successfully installed lighter seats in their Z8. Steve Dinan, who is building the new motor for my car, promised to save some weight in the process (lighter internal parts, oil-water heat exchanger eliminated, lighter exhaust, etc.) and I am hopeful that I can reach my goal of shaving a total of 200 lbs. from the car. It will still be too heavy for optimum performance but it's not a race car and I still want to enjoy the creature comforts which make the Z8 such a delight to drive. Grease Monkey

[Z8doc]

the handling of the Z8 and improving the lap time for the Z8 would be just having a better seat in the first place. The seats in the Z8 are aestheically pleasing but leave alot to be desired as far as keeping the driver firmly planted in the seat when going through the turns. The new M6's seat is so much better in that regard (just like my 1988 M6's seat is). In my track experience, the fact that the seat is nearly flat with barely adequate side bolster support, I find myself sliding around quite a bit which directly decreases the driver's ability to 'handle' the car while cornering.

Although any weight reduction is a good thing, I think just having a better seat and restraint system, with or without any weight reduction, would most likely trim a couple seconds off anyone's lap time, especially a professional driver. I bought a CG Lock for my Z8 to use on track days. It definitely helped and is about as close to a multipoint harness you can get without making that modification to your car and would seriously recommend it to anyone who is tracking regularly (or doing alot of sprited driving!) -- It really helps keep you planted in the seat much better than the OEM set belt setup.

[Wldeyefoto]

I agree completely with your statements regarding the benefits of a more supportive seat in the Z8. I have modified the driver's seat in my Z8 so that it has much better side support, custom lumbar support, and a deeper bucket, yet it looks stock! I also use the CG-Lock and find the combination adequate, though not ideal. If I could find a lighter weight seat with much better support, that is what I would like to install. I'd also like to sit lower in the car, partly to lower the CG and partly to reduce wind buffeting in the cockpit. I am also toying with installing a full harness anchored to the roll bar but the compatibility issues are daunting. Ah, the never-ending quest!Grease Monkey