Steve Cohen & Charlie I call you Out

[Ethan W]

Steve Cohen thanks for the e-mail but I am not impressed. A true leader comes up with the right solution regardless of the environment and its dynamics. That being said lets get to the bottom of this one for once and fix it. The root of the problem is the stupid “Lounge” so before you lose too many people from both camps let’s just fix that. I am not going to cry about my intelligence being insulted about modomotics behind their key boards and I am not going to feel sorry for the language and attitude used in this board. You get back what you ask for and I hope it hurts in your camp as much it hurts in this camp.

Last I check this was a democracy and as such we should VOTE for combining the Lounge with the main E31 forum into one. Until you fix that problem people will be divided in between the two camps. Yes we may be a minority but we have the some rights. Just fix the darn thing and I guarantee you, everyone will be happy…

As of the webmaster comment, sometime I wonder in what kind of world some of you guys live in. In that entire conversation you haven’t made one comment or suggestion and yet have the balls to make those statements toward my ethics. Hmmm, let me see how do I put this… Can I please smoke some of that???

With that beings said I suggest we all vote for combining the two forums and I am sure the outcome will make some people happy and some other unhappy. After all we don’t live in a prefect world but there is enough room for common sense.

[rrmusante]

<table><caption align="bottom">Tigard,Oregon
1991 850i
2003 325xi Sport Wagon
2001 325i Sedan
1987 325is "Dinan Stage II" Track Car
<caption><tr><td><img src="http://members.roadfly.com/rrmusante/maryandme8fest.JPG"alt="Dinan:Chips,Springs,Camber plate,K-Bar,SS Brakelines 3.91ls diff,17" Throwing Startsmiles"></td></tr></table>

[Scohen]

[Scohen]

the webmaster runs his business -- find another sand box to play in.


I do not speak for the webmaster .... IMHO his business is not a democracy he will run it the way he desires ... not how you desire that he run his business. His decisions are his decisions alone. Not yours, mine, or someone else's.

Long before you came to the board the lounge was instituted to prevent non-E-31 posts on the main board. Accept that as a fact of life. If you do not wish to do so ... GO PLAY IN A DIFFERENT SANDBOX.

BTW I do not understand why you think I have anything to do with RoadFly. I am not connected in any way, shape, or form with the company. Standard disclaimer, etc., etc., etc.

[Ethan W]

OK everybody time to VOTE but not before a bit of background.

• Some people here, Camp-1 believe that too many OT are being posted in the main E31 technical forum distracting everybody else from the essence and the goal of the E31 technical forum. For that Camp-1 is empowered with the Mod-O-Matic tool which allows them to kill any OT posts.

• Another group of people, Camp-2 believe that posting OT in the main forum is OK and it does not really distract the others and the Modo-O-Matic should be disabled. One more argument is that now you have to go to two different forums in order to keep up with the E31 community at a technical level as well as OT level. But the biggest issue that I see is that the Mod-O-Matic tool is being used very unfair and inconsistent. Very much depends on who posts the OT in the main E31 forum and for that the OT post sometime gets killed and sometime not. Bottom line the system is being abused and used unfairly by individuals who don’t have the balls to step up and take a constructive approach to this OT issue in the main forum. Those individuals don’t even have the balls to admit they’re killing specific OT threads and allowing others.

So with that in mind I propose to VOTE for allowing OT posts in the main E31 forum and disabling the Lounge. From all BMW forums on RoadFly Only E31 and M3 have lounges and it looks like everybody else can coexist together just fine.

I don’t know what rules and framework we should use for voting and that’s not my place or job. I believe the webmasters of this forum can deal with that.

As soon as we have a voting process and framework in place, let’s just do it and put this to rest for once.
Can we all just get along and have some fun while learning about our cars?

[Ethan W]

This business would not exists without people on this forum and as such WE have a SAY.

Some of you guys initiated this OT mess and as such the webmaster provided you with the right tool and venue to execute you mess.

No, I chose not to go play in a different sandbox, I chose not to be silent about this stupid mess.

[alan]

Charlie could tell you that behind the scenes we have had a lot of discussions about just this topic.

Here's what we would like to see: compromise from BOTH sides of this issue.

Ok, first things first. Our system still isn't fully implemented. It is supposed to be the case that when something gets MoM'd for being off-topic that it automatically gets moved to the Lounge, and a link to it gets put in the main board. That's the same thing that happens with For Sale posts.

But, I haven't finished implementing everything necessary for each board to know whether it has a Lounge or not in terms of MoM. So, right now, when a post gets MoM'd, it disappears off of the main board but doesn't get put in the Lounge.

That's where patience, tolerance, and I come in. I don't read the boards 24/7. I have a real job (Roadfly certainly doesn't pay my bills), and I also have a life...and like to sleep from time to time. When I'm not doing one of those things, I check for posts that have been MoM'd, re-enable them, and put them in the Lounge where they belong. I realize this is a second-rate solution, but eventually we will have a better automatic one like I said.

If you see something get MoM'd that you think was done so unfairly, EMAIL ME about it! I'll take care of it, or at least I'll do my best to be honest with you about why it shouldn't be on the board.

Now, on the other side, Steve, et al--it would help a LOT if you guys practiced a little more tolerance. Jim's original Father's Day post was off topic for sure, but come on--it wasn't particularly horrible and didn't really get in the way of anything. All the other boards here, including the E46 M3 board, cut people a little more slack when it comes to off topic things. Don't have such an itchy trigger finger.

And, on the other hand, if you (i.e. anyone reading this post) makes a post on the main board and it gets MoM'd, please don't go and post a bunch of curse words complaining and yelling about various things. Instead, just email me, let me know that you feel something was removed unfairly, and give me a chance to do something about it.

Please don't ask that the Lounge be removed. That's not going to happen. It is up in the air whether each board should have a separate Lounge, whether there should be one large general Lounge, or whether there should be a few Lounges like there are right now. But, what is definitely true is that every board needs a place where off topic posts can go that is NOT on the main board. That isn't to say that off topic stuff can never go on the main board. I think that Jim's original Father's Day post should have been cut a little slack and should NOT have been MoM'd.

Moderation in everything, or something like that...

--Alan

[Ethan W]

1. The right place for OT posts is not the lounge but the main forum. Do the math here. How many OT posts you have in the lounge vs. technical posts in the main E31 since lounge was implemented. I bet you money you will have 80% technical related posts and 20% OT. Is that 20 percent justifying the effort to maintain a dedicated OT place such as the lounge?
2. Allowing the forum to govern itself via mod-o-matic will never work. People are not perfect and sooner or later they will take it personal
3. Is impractical for E31 folks to now read two forums. Yes some people may not care for OT stuff so they won’t go to lounge for that. I say to them, skip the OT posts in the E31 forum if that may be the final configuration
4. Some people are too itchy trigger finger or they just don’t like someone and they will pull the modo-matic trigger
5. There is not such a thing called tolerance and moderation. The current situation is a perfect example of that and mess and is coming from both camps but for different reasons.
6. The webmaster managing all momed posts is unsustainable and a bit childish. Do you really have to police the government model you just put in place? If you have to police it then something don’t work, right?
7. Some people here have to be more open minded, and life is not always as serious as they take it, so once in a while “Happy Father Day” OT posts are OK. Aren’t we all human after all
8. Not all forums have lounges, almost 97% of those, so obviously the no lounge, no mod-o-matic model works just fine. Why so difficult with this crowd
9. The true root of this problem is that some people with big egos think that this forum should be managed their way. Regardless of how much weight, credibility you have this is still a free place to talk about E31 matters at a technical level as well as personal. After all we all are humans right?
10. After all this E31 community is like a family sharing technical knowledge as well as emotions and feelings. Can’t we all just do it in one place and not be so damn uptight about it?

[JIM IN NYC]

1991 RACING DYNAMICS K55 6 SPEED 13,500 MILES
2006 JAG XKR
1993 850 Parts Car
1992 850 Parts Car
1994 850 Parts Car

[JIM IN NYC]

1991 RACING DYNAMICS K55 6 SPEED 13,500 MILES
2006 JAG XKR
1993 850 Parts Car
1992 850 Parts Car
1994 850 Parts Car

[JIM NYC]

1991 RACING DYNAMICS K55 6 SPEED 13,500 MILES
2006 JAG XKR
1993 850 Parts Car
1992 850 Parts Car
1994 850 Parts Car

[Charles]

I really don't care whether there is a lounge or not, but I want the board to be a resource for people who have questions about a very complex car. So, I vote to have only technical input on the main board.

Charles

[JIM NYC]

to strong 1991 RACING DYNAMICS K55 6 SPEED 13,500 MILES
2006 JAG XKR
1993 850 Parts Car
1992 850 Parts Car
1994 850 Parts Car

[jef]

[Mark in SBA]

Your incessant rantings about rectums and ********s and fluency in French can only mean you're grappling with questions about your sexuality. Go into the light, and come out of the closet. After all, the transsexual lifestyle offers you several avenues for self-expression.

I've taken the opportunity to photoshop your camo party into some positive suggestions.

There's the tough but sensitive Jim:

<center><img src="http://www.arthist.lu.se/visualculture/Pink_Flamingos_mellomstort.jpg"></center>

The exhibitionistic yet artistic Jim (grrr, you tiger!):

<center><img src="http://www.geocities.com/WestHollywood/Heights/2493/divine.jpg"></center>

And best of all, you don't need to give up your double-wide adjacent the Fresh Kills dump there on Staten Island:

<center><img src="http://www.malba.org.ar/files/tn_imagen_t3_578c"></center>

It's all uphill Jim, and your alternative lifestyle will pay dividends almost immediately when you can let go of your secret angst.

Keep those E31 parts and feathered boas coming, you dog, you.

[JIM NYC]

1991 RACING DYNAMICS K55 6 SPEED 13,500 MILES
2006 JAG XKR
1993 850 Parts Car
1992 850 Parts Car
1994 850 Parts Car

[JIM NYC]

1991 RACING DYNAMICS K55 6 SPEED 13,500 MILES
2006 JAG XKR
1993 850 Parts Car
1992 850 Parts Car
1994 850 Parts Car

[JIM IN NYC]

1991 RACING DYNAMICS K55 6 SPEED 13,500 MILES
2006 JAG XKR
1993 850 Parts Car
1992 850 Parts Car
1994 850 Parts Car

[Robert]

I like Tom, he is a very nice person and there are a lot of people who will back me on this one, I just started going to his forum, it will grow with time, I feel that with time this forum will fade if this keeps on going the way it is.

[Oops!] and the other sites are growing now.

[Faisal_in_Laurel]

Anche in italiano. Non pensate la gente avere Babelfish?<html>
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