Thank you, ACLU (verrrrry long)

[Donkey]

Here in California we have a thing called "Free school for everyone." This basically means that taxpayers' children (and those of non-paying illegal aliens, of course) receive K-12 schooling for no additional charge. Pretty standard stuff across the country, I imagine.

So far so good, right? But how about extra-curricular activities? Like, say... football. Track. Math club. Cheerleading. Stuff we all took for granted when we were in high school.

Things are different today in Cali, baby - the school districts can't afford to pay for those programs anymore, at least not entirely. These programs *REQUIRE* outside sources of funds to exist - for things like uniforms and other equipment, coaches' stipends, travel expenses... you name it, it usually has to be paid for from extra-district sources. But... keep in mind that all these activities are VOLUNTARY on the part of the students and their families.

So, the programs turn to booster clubs for help with fund raising. The typical setup is to have participating students pay a portion of the required monies in fees and add the rest via fundraisers (and you are usually given the choice of "buying out" of the fundraiser by writing another check to the program). Additionally, we happen to have a "Foundation" which is a 503(c) org and oversees all this activity - meaning it receives a full outside audit every year.

Apparently, someone somewhere in our great state decided their kid should be able to participate in these extra-curricular (and expensive) programs FOR FREE. And when they were asked to pay their fees, they instead cried to the ACLU, who has now begun poking their noses into the situation, holding districts to the strict letter of the law: School for Free.

The ACLU's interpretation is that if the activity is offered, then all kids must be able to participate FOR FREE. Fees cannot be mandatory.

So... booster clubs/programs cannot require kids to pay fees - it must be a voluntary payment, or the funds must be raised thru fundraisers - and you can't force a kid to participate in a fundraiser. What these families apparently fail to realize (or don't care about) is that SOMEONE has to pay for this stuff, and it isn't coming from state tax revenue.

And before the bleeding hearts reading this start crying "Well, Johnny shouldn't be excluded just because his family doesn't have financial means..." I couldn't agree more. And in our programs, we have a slush fund set up to help with families with such needs, and we have programs in which kids can help defray by working the snack bar, etc. But there are limits built in to these handouts, and still, some families try to take advantage.

Our district has responded to this ACLU "investigation" by saying "if you can't work it out, we'll simply shut down ALL extracurricular programs."

And that, my e-buddies, would be a real shame.

<br />
<br />
"Sent from my iFag"
<br />
<br />


<br/><br/><br/>
Bitte nutzen Sie die E-Mail-Verbindung mit uns ausschliesslich zum
Informationsaustausch. Wir koennen auf diesem Wege keine
rechtsgeschaeftlichen Erklaerungen (Auftraege etc.) entgegennehmen.
Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur fuer den angegebenen
Empfaenger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisnahme oder Weitergabe
durch Dritte ist unzulaessig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht fur Sie bestimmt
sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in
Verbindung zu setzen.

[M_Six]

It seems the blame belongs with the freeloaders who complained to the ACLU. The ACLU investigation is merely to ensure that students aren't being excluded because their parents can't or won't pony up funds. And it is just that, an investigation. No lawsuit filed yet, right?

Seems to me the district is just being a bit pro-active in avoiding an ACLU lawsuit by changing the rules. If someone in your neighborhood complains about speeding and the cops send a squad car to set up a speed trap and nail you for doing 5 over, do you blame the cops or the squeaky wheel neighbor?_________________________________________ ___________________


Mark
<img src="http://www.bimmermail.com/boston2.JPG" height=77 width=449>
"Things break; it's scientific." - D. Byrne

[Donkey]

It is a crutch organization which is more than willing to protect the "rights" of a few at the expense of many. Why do you think they were brought in in the first place?

What about the rights of the students who want to participate and who are willing to pay their fair share?

Do you really blame the district for wanting to avoid an immensely costly, high profile lawsuit which it will likely lose anyway - especially at a time when teachers are being laid off for lack of funds???

This is simply a case of the ACLU giving a strong(er) voice to someone who is likely trying to work the system, and when all is said and done, the only losers will be the people who were trying to do it the "right" way.

<br />
<br />
"Sent from my iFag"
<br />
<br />


<br/><br/><br/>
Bitte nutzen Sie die E-Mail-Verbindung mit uns ausschliesslich zum
Informationsaustausch. Wir koennen auf diesem Wege keine
rechtsgeschaeftlichen Erklaerungen (Auftraege etc.) entgegennehmen.
Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur fuer den angegebenen
Empfaenger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisnahme oder Weitergabe
durch Dritte ist unzulaessig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht fur Sie bestimmt
sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in
Verbindung zu setzen.

[@ gregory528iT]

club with my brother and sister in law. They live mid state Illinois, so I won't get into the differences. As strong Booster supporters, they were all about raising funds for the Football team, raising funds cause not all the kids could afford to pay, and they still wanted them to be able to play. I was kinda surprised, cause they would side with you on most issues pertaining to the money grubbing poor people asking for hand outs. ;)

Their gripe was not with funding the poor kids on the football team, but the school trying to steer Football Booster money into other sports. I believe they shut that down.





<img src="http://members.roadfly.com/gregory528it/sigpicture2.jpg"




In MY bag.
Taylor Made R7 TP 9.5°, RE AX 75,
Taylor Made Burner TP, 14.5°
Taylor Made Burner TP, 17.5°
Taylor Made R7 Steel 7W 21°
Titleist AP2s 4-PW, Dynamic Gold S300
Titleist 54°.14 Vokey Spin Mill SW
Titleist 60°.04 Vokey Spin Mill LW
Oddessy "Dual Force 440" (bullseye with insert) putter, 34"
Titleist ProV1

[SheB]

.... wanting something for nothing, and expecting the rest of us hard-working stiffs to pay their way. Sad!!

[Donkey]

Our school's extracurricular charter explicitly prohibits redirection of funds raised by booster clubs. This does not (of course) pertain to other sources - eg., ticket sales at games - that goes into the general ASB fund, and a percentage is sent back to the organization generating the fund.

Don't get me wrong, I want every kid to have a chance to participate. As mentioned, we had/have a slush fund just for such contingencies. But if a family participates in that, then they are expected to pick up some of (just some - far from the whole mark) the slack by performing other duties: snack bar work, tutoring, that sort of thing. We're talking MAYBE 10-15 hours over the course of a season 10-week season.

But its the families (let's be honest - it's the PARENTS) who want something for nothing, and who don't care that while their kid gets to play for free, that means other families are footing the bill.

They, with the assistance of the ACLU, could spell the end to organized school sports/activities in CA.

<br />
<br />
"Sent from my iFag"
<br />
<br />


<br/><br/><br/>
Bitte nutzen Sie die E-Mail-Verbindung mit uns ausschliesslich zum
Informationsaustausch. Wir koennen auf diesem Wege keine
rechtsgeschaeftlichen Erklaerungen (Auftraege etc.) entgegennehmen.
Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur fuer den angegebenen
Empfaenger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisnahme oder Weitergabe
durch Dritte ist unzulaessig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht fur Sie bestimmt
sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in
Verbindung zu setzen.

[RustyNCA]

[DDB]

I wonder what the per-head cost would be for each participant of an activity in order to completely do away with all the booster club waste-of-time-and-energy nonsense?

The ACLU's position as you portray it is obviously ridiculous. If French Club decides to organize a 5-day trip to Paris, would the ACLU contend that the participants must be able to go on the trip FOR FREE?

- DDB

[DDB]

Are gate receipts not sufficient to meet the funding needs of the "bigger" sports, like boy's varsity football/basketball?

[540sport]

If they had a case they would have pushed harder from the start with a big splashy press conference to announce their lawsuit. That's their style.

Extra-curricular activities are just as their name suggests, outside the curriculum. They are voluntary and partly supported by fees. Contrast them with co-curricular activities like band and choir.
Vin
98 540 Sport with everything & extra hots
BMW CCA, Boston Chapter
"The 540 is the head-case supermodel girlfriend..." Eric S.
"The worst thing you could do with your money is save it." ~ Jackie Gleason
If everything seems under control, you're just not going fast enough. Mario Andretti
The United States is a nation of laws: poorly written and randomly enforced. - Frank Zappa

[Donkey]

no student could be forced to pay fees to participate: that is, all payments from students would be voluntary, and any shortfall would be generated by outside fundraising.

Regarding "booster club nonsense" get back to me in 15 years when (assuming that unlike you, your boy grows up to have at least a glimmer of athletic talent) you ahve some experience under your belt.

During my involvement in my son's football team's boosters, we generated right around $50k / year thru fundraising. We helped get a turf field installed, helped establish a pop warner program for our area (which turned out to be an amazing benefit to the team), and provided the program with all sorts of needed equipment (endzone cameras, gamefilm systems, etc.).

Oh, and maybe it was just coincidence, but during that tenure the team won it's league championship for the first time in school history, and played in the CIF final for its division at Qualcomm Stadium, also a first for the school.

Maybe the boosters in your area comprise nannys who like to sit around and gossip?<br />
<br />
"Sent from my iFag"
<br />
<br />


<br/><br/><br/>
Bitte nutzen Sie die E-Mail-Verbindung mit uns ausschliesslich zum
Informationsaustausch. Wir koennen auf diesem Wege keine
rechtsgeschaeftlichen Erklaerungen (Auftraege etc.) entgegennehmen.
Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur fuer den angegebenen
Empfaenger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisnahme oder Weitergabe
durch Dritte ist unzulaessig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht fur Sie bestimmt
sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in
Verbindung zu setzen.

[Donkey]

<i>"Our school's extracurricular charter explicitly prohibits redirection of funds raised by booster clubs. This does not (of course) pertain to other sources - eg., ticket sales at games - that goes into the general ASB fund, and a percentage is sent back to the organization generating the fund."<i>

In any case, NO, gate receipts would not cover the cost of the program: I suggest you do a little research into the cost of these programs.
<br />
<br />
"Sent from my iFag"
<br />
<br />


<br/><br/><br/>
Bitte nutzen Sie die E-Mail-Verbindung mit uns ausschliesslich zum
Informationsaustausch. Wir koennen auf diesem Wege keine
rechtsgeschaeftlichen Erklaerungen (Auftraege etc.) entgegennehmen.
Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur fuer den angegebenen
Empfaenger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisnahme oder Weitergabe
durch Dritte ist unzulaessig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht fur Sie bestimmt
sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in
Verbindung zu setzen.

[Donkey]

a consequence of their current activity has directly affected my daughter's cheer team. Specifically, if the cheer team wants to participate in the usual competitions this calendar year, the team must raise nearly $13,000 by the end of October - and none of it may be collected via "required" fees as in years past.

Practically speaking, since in this economy it is virtually impossible to get fundraising donations from people not directly involved in the program(s), what this change means is that some families will "voluntarily contribute" significantly more than their "fair share" of that amount so that the team can continue on. Why? Because we don't want to see the programs evaporate: and it's all too easy to imagine the district pulling the plug rather than doing battle with ACLU.

Sadly, there doesn't appear to be any smoke-blowing going on here.

<br />
<br />
"Sent from my iFag"
<br />
<br />


<br/><br/><br/>
Bitte nutzen Sie die E-Mail-Verbindung mit uns ausschliesslich zum
Informationsaustausch. Wir koennen auf diesem Wege keine
rechtsgeschaeftlichen Erklaerungen (Auftraege etc.) entgegennehmen.
Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur fuer den angegebenen
Empfaenger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisnahme oder Weitergabe
durch Dritte ist unzulaessig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht fur Sie bestimmt
sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in
Verbindung zu setzen.

[DDB]

(you're so defensive)

What's the roster size of a typical HS squad nowadays - 50? That's $1K per kid per year, which is a great deal for the parents and players. So yeah, if you broke it down to a per-head cost, could do away with booster club. You're obviously proud of your booster efforts, but one wonders how many hours you spent vs. how much your efforts generated, and whether you would have been better off just cutting a check for that amount each year.

- DDB

[DDB]

And sorry, I didn't see your other post before I asked the question about gate receipts.

[Donkey]

My last year, we had over 160 kids in the program (all three teams). Varsity was usually in the 75-80 range, JV maybe 40, and the rest on frosh.

Your logic is also flawed in that you assume a balanced budget each year with a net-zero gain/loss over the previous year.

The turf field was right around $1.1M. Of course, some of this was covered thru loans from the district in exhange for one of our members drilling a couple wells at the school and setting up a deal where the school sells water back to the water authority. So I'm not sure how we would simply "cut a check" for that activity.

A single team's uniforms, which last maybe two years, ran around $12k. Cut another check? Or do the fund-raising?

Don't get me wrong - I understand your "hands-off" attitude, given that you don't (yet) have a clue about what it's like to be involved in your kids' activities.

Finally and especially with football, the goal is to create a "program" - not just get your kid thru each year of playing games. This requires coordinated effort at a variety of levels (establishing pop warner was a large effort with huge dividends in terms of the quality of athletes the program now receives at the freshman level). Which in turn requires continuity at the booster level... think of it in terms of running a business: how effective would you be if upper management turned over every year (or worse, simply didn't exist)?

It's not that I'm "proud of my efforts." It's about being involved with my kid, and doing something good for the organization at the same time.

Hopefully you'll get a chance to experience this at some point: far more rewarding than dropping your kid off with a check in hand.

<br />
<br />
"Sent from my iFag"
<br />
<br />


<br/><br/><br/>
Bitte nutzen Sie die E-Mail-Verbindung mit uns ausschliesslich zum
Informationsaustausch. Wir koennen auf diesem Wege keine
rechtsgeschaeftlichen Erklaerungen (Auftraege etc.) entgegennehmen.
Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur fuer den angegebenen
Empfaenger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisnahme oder Weitergabe
durch Dritte ist unzulaessig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht fur Sie bestimmt
sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in
Verbindung zu setzen.