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  1. #1
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    Member No: 17983 horse325es is on a distinguished road horse325es's Avatar
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    Yes | No

    Down to the last jug of A3 approved M1 15/50

    I had sooo much Mobil1 15/50 stocked up in my garage (15 5 quart jugs) that i didn't notice the new M1 15/50 is not meet A3 requirements that BMW needs. Bought it all for 15 bux a jug from a "going out of business sale" at a lube shop

    i wish i knew this before i wasted the A3 15/50 oil on my blazer instead of the newer 15/50.

    Sucks but im gonna have to run thinner oil next summer on the e39.

    Andreas
    Queens NY
    BMWCCA# 186796
    86 325es (wrecked by careless driver)
    87 325 (project for life)
    00 540is 6spd (daily driver)


  2. #2
    Craig in Canada
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    Yes | No

    Not necessarily

    ACEA A3 lists minimum specs for HTHS, viscosity etc... but also properties pertaining to extended drain performance (similar to, but not as extensive as, the BMW LL-01 tests).

    The reason I always mention ACEA A3 is it's the only way to know if you have a high enough HTHS 30 or "thin 40" without fully reading and understanding the PDS. At grades like 15W50, the HTHS is definitely high enough that you don't NEED to look for A3 on the bottle.

    If new M1 15W50 has lost ACEA A3 - I wonder why? It won't be viscosity or HTHS, perhaps it is either they did not wish to pay for ACEA testing/licensing (just like Redline and Amsoil don't pay for API licensing despite making great oils) or there are issues with extended drains and the new 15W50.

    If you like it, it works well for you, and you change it at reasonable intervals (half the car's service indicator, for instance) I'd just keep running it. Personally I feel it's too thick and a good 5W40 would serve you better year-round in NY, but that's just my opinion. M1 keeps changing 15W50 - some of the formulas have been reported to be way thinner than what a 15W50 really should be (more like a 5W45, if such a thing existed). When I ran 15W50 red cap in my Porsche in the early 2000s it was REALLY thick. Anything below 45F and cold starts felt laboured. You couldn't even crank the engine with #4 booster cables (they just got hot) and it felt like you were dragging something until the oil warmed up. I heard they brought back a 5W50, but I can't find it on the Mobil site right now.

    Mobil1 has a 5W40 TDT (labeled as diesel and truck) which a lot of people like. I'd also recommend a look at Rotella T6 5W40 if you were entertaining a switch. In my M52 Mobil1 products made the engine noisy. T6 is reported by lots of Euro brand owners to be really smooth and quiet (as well as being a great oil).


  3. #3
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    Yes | No

    I was a die hard Mobil1 fanatic till this week.

    This was all pre 2001 oil. The old jugs i have dont have the newer labels that say "New and improved formula"

    Your 100% right, the old 15/50 was a lot thicker than the current 15/50.

    My old worked e30 could barely idle in the winter till the oil warmed up. Same feeling like ur dragging something when driving or a heavy load on the engine at idle. Either way the old 15/50 was the best.

    Btw i thought dino oil is against the rules when it comes to m62tu's



    Andreas
    Queens NY
    BMWCCA# 186796
    86 325es (wrecked by careless driver)
    87 325 (project for life)
    00 540is 6spd (daily driver)

  4. #4
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    Member No: 16800 calemon is an unknown quantity at this point calemon's Avatar
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    Yes | No

    Re: I was a die hard Mobil1 fanatic till this week.

    Re: old = better

    "thick" isn't better unless you need thick. The mantra of a lot of oil fans is "As thin as possible; as thick as necessary". You need to be thick enough to support the engine's design and operating environment but any thicker than that isn't doing anyone any good. Better a little thick than a little thin, though, especially in a Euro design.

    Re: E30 barely idle - that means it was too thick for conditions :) Imagine the stress going on inside various areas of the engine (and possible lack of top end lubrication) as it can barely idle. The potential extra protection of the 50 in some conditions may be offset by the issues at startup. If I knew then what I know now, I would have just run 15W40 in my Porsche and confirmed suitability and change interval with an oil analysis.

    Re: dino against the rules. If you look at E39 family oil recommendations around the world (for the same engine) you'll see all kinds of different things adjusted for the region in question. USA has pressures of CAFE combined with low speeds, a general trend towards automotive neglect and marketing trends of "no maintenance". They're going to spec a thin, long-drain oil that will run the factory 18k intervals. In Europe they see high speeds, expensive oil, no CAFE and a more driver-oriented frame of mind. They spec heavier, but still long-drain oils. My owner's manual's primary recommendation is dino 15W40 I think but if you're unable to start the car around -18 or so, switch to a lighter oil.

    Today's dinos are really good. Way better than even 10 years ago. The E39 engine family is easy on oil. They don't have issues like the Direct Injection families, Toyotas (high head temp, too slow oil flow - sludge), Saabs, TDIs (extreme cam pressure on the PD models) etc... The only challenge with dinos in our cars are 1/ maintaining "thick enough" properties at operating temp but "thin enough" in areas with cold winters and 2/ change interval.

    For 1/ dinos really only have the 10W40 weight as the "lightest" oil that's thick enough. I'm not aware of any dino 5W30s which are "thick 30s" and can support Euro engines but they could be out there. If you want grades like GC 0W30, 0W40 and 5W40 to support colder weather you need to go syn.

    For 2/ just be smart. If you're changing oil every 5k in Texas, Florida or California (examples) you're wasting syn, really. But there's nothing wrong with pampering your car - it's better than neglect. :)

    The M62TU and M52 in my "fleet" are very happy on dino 15W40 @ ~5k intervals (could probably go a lot farther because HDEOs have lots of dispersants, detergents and acid fighting compounds). It's snowing outside right now and my dad still has his 15W40 left over from Auto-RX rinse and it isn't causing problems. We're switching it out for the last of the family stock of GC very soon - probably this afternoon. Around freezing is about as low as I'd want to *regularly* go on dino 15W40, although there's plenty of data out there showing that -15C is more like the real cutoff.

    Starting with the spring change we're going with T6. A possible change up might be T (15W40) for the summer change and T6 (5W40) for the winter change. Since we're sticking with the same product line the additive packs should be fully compatible and not cause us problems from switching oils. For me, I'm trying to retain the operating temp smoothness I observe at high revs with 40s. For my dad we're trying to minimize his VANOS rattle and keep it quiet now that it's dramatically reduced.


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